>> reporter: he haevan didn't h time to scream. his helmet almost split apart by the impact saved his life and he expects the helmet maker to make a commercial. we can see it now. >> sorry about that. we'll get that right the next time. thank you very much for watching. i'm wolf blitzer in "the situation room." the news continues next on cnn. good evening, everyone. important breaking news tonight. the president sends u.s. troops into central africa against a foe most of us have never even heard of and one of the nation's toughest immigration laws faces a major setback tonight and here in washington a significant concession and retreat by the obama administration in the health care reform debate. the white house told congress this afternoon that it is unable to go forward with a long-term care plan that is a big part of the giant obama health care law. the administration now says the law as written does not allow the long-term care program to be implemented in a way that would make it financially stable.

congressional republicans say good riddens. they wanted to repeal that program any way. shifting to major new developments in the occupy wall street protest and rage in cities across the country today. protesters vented anger and frustration and police responded in riot gear. 24 people arrested in denver. in new york city, police detained 14 people for blocking traffic overturning trash bins and throwing bottles. a major clash between protesters and police barely averted in manhattan today. the company that owns the park where hundreds have been camped out for the past month decided not to kick the protesters out today. occupy wall street protesters say it proves their point is getting across. >> it's really catching on and the more the city pushes back or the owners of the park push back, the more the people will come. >> the new york mayor michael bloomberg had a very different take. >> protesters have the bottom line is i don't necessarily agree with their message or

their targets. >> take a look at this. the scuffle between a police protester was recorded by a phone camera. it appears to show someone on the ground, his foot apparently caught under the wheel of a police officer's motorcycle. the man appears to be screaming in pain and yelling what's your badge number and seconds later the man is dragged five or six feet and subdued facedown with a police officer's baton at the back of his neck. new york police have not yet commented on this incident. is this an important political movement or as the mayor suggests, a growing public safety problem? you have both been very supportive of these protesters. how do you deal with the idea that, yes, they have free speech rights and making an important political statement but in some cases they are getting mayors and police chiefs more than a little annoyed. >> the answer to the question is that it is a growing political movement and that you talked

about one incident but consider that there are hundreds of these occupations happening all across the country that are completely peaceful and they are speaking to the conscience of our nation because it's no longer possible to work hard for a living and support a family and 50 million people are looking for work. i think this occupy movement is an incredible inspiration to people who don't believe that things are fair any longer and that this gross inequality in our economy has to be addressed. >> as they protest in the streets against inequality and against what they consider too much corporate greed, some complain about college costs, if you go to different places some of the complaints are different. how do you see it playing out as we move from this odd numbered year into the even number election year? i say that in the sense that obviously the anger is focused on wall street. that's where you see the biggest protes protests. if you go around the country where you have seen crowds, those are areas traditionally controlled by democrats. are you concerned that all of their strength and throw bums

out anger is where your party is strong? >> this is what democracy looks like. an economic democracy is a precondition of a political democracy. this isn't just theory. it's fact. the wealth is accelerating to the top. there are more people unemployed. 14 million unemployed. people are losing their homes. 6.5 million people will lose their homes in the next round of foreclosures. 50 million people without health care. people losing their retirement security and young people not being able to afford to go to college. we need this. america needs a response and the response has to come from the streets frankly because it's not coming from washington. >> and so this has captured everyone's attention. whether you are a union leader, democrat or republican, herman cain skyrocketing to the top spot in the republican race for president, he writes this --

>> i think he's speaking to the question of what kind of country do we want to be? are we a country that's going to be everybody for themselves or we're all in this together? i think what occupy is trying to tell us is let's get in this together. this gross inequality doesn't have to be -- we are a great nation. we can make 50 million people get back to work in january if we made a decision between the government and private sector to make that happen. >> between the government and the private sector. congressman, we see the protests in the streets here. we don't know what it means politically yet because we don't have an election in front of us. we saw tea party protests all around the country and here in washington and we did see a result. neither of you like the result but we did see a result in 2010 at the ballot box. how do we know that what we're seeing today will mean anything when to comes to november 2012?

>> it's important to remember that concerns that helped the tea party movement, i met with tea party people from the cleveland area. they have a lot in common with the people who are occupying wall street around the country. and so what i look for are commonalities. if we unite people around economic issues and getti intin america back to work and changing the monetary system where the fed isn't calling the shot and making it possible for young people to go to school and ensuring the america people they'll have retirement security, we can put everything back together again. let me tell you something, the hold that corporations have on our government right now is pretty severe. the citizens united case and the buckley versus vallejo case before it, put the power in the hands of the corporations who essentially make up our elections an auction. we need to change that. the message from the street is this system isn't working and people are determined to see a new system come forward and

frankly this is what founders anticipated in order to create a more perfect union. this is what democracy looks like. that perfect union continues to evolve. >> you are both in the organizing business. you ran a campaign for president. you have your mayor. you keep your seat in congress. you're one of the nation's largest and most politically powerful unions. how do you get them off the streets? you want them on the streets protesting but how do you make energy and bodies and get them involved in campaigns? in working to do the business of changing things. all of the things you just mentioned to get them done, you have a democratic president. obviously if you want to do campaign finance citizens united you need votes in congress and you don't have them right now. how do you take them and get them involved in the system when they don't trust the system and they may not trust either of you? >> we think it's our responsibility as working people to be a part of that campaign and get in the streets and we think the occupy protesters can continue to shine a light on this problem while we also get organized for the political system. we intend to have 300,000 of our members out in the street with the rest of working people

making the case that we have to make this next election a mandate for addressing this terrible inequality. >> you raised a very important point and that is how do you motivate people? the democratic party had as a big responsibility here. i don't trust the system, john. i fought it my whole career. i will tell you this, we're going to get people to move from the streets to the polling place. the only way you're going to do that is for the democratic party to articulate a true program for change. we're not there yet. i think that politics being what it is, we'll look at this movement and say the only way we can get it to be attracted toward what we're doing is put in our platform and have our candidate probably barack obama go out there and work for it. this is going to change things. >> you say probably. there's no doubt about that. >> i think he's the probable nominee. >> one of the hard parts for progressive politicians in the cities -- i had a conversation with the mayor of boston the other day. he said i share their goals. i'm a middle class guy.

you can't mess with my police department. when they say stop, you have to stop. mayor bloomberg had issues. you have every right to speak. agree with most of your goals but the mayor said he thinks i get your point but perhaps you're directing it in the wrong way. >> half of the people that work on wall street earn something less than $72,000 a year and if you look at the report yesterday or the day before 10,000 more job losses in finance here in the city. that's not good for our economy. >> the mayor is making the point that i know you're mad at the big guys on wall street but a lot of little guys work on wall street too. does he have a point? >> i think the notion that he's linking that to what the occupiers are doing is not the right linkage. what occupiers are trying to say is that the top 1% in this country need to think about the common good and how is it that kids who play by the rules, went to college, are drowning in debt and can't find a job, what are

we going to do about that problem as a nation? and what is it that we can do collectively to require that it's possible to play by the rules and expect that we're going to be able to support ourselves. that's a very simple question that's getting asked that we need to answer. >> you have to look all across this country and struggles that labor is having right now state by state like in ohio. public workers are trying to defend their basic rights. this is an economic fight with right to organize and collective bargaining and right to strike and decent wages and benefits and secure workplace. they have an economic component. the mayor -- i've been a mayor. i understand what his concerns are. the mayor had as to keep in mind that new york being the great world city that it has to be welcoming and the fact that they protest economic conditions today i say good for them and keep it nonviolent and you'll get a lot more support.

>> thank you both for coming in. fascinating movement. we'll keep watching. another controversial remark from the wife of rick perry. did president obama cost her son his job? and a rough patch in court for the immigration law. i'm not a number. i'm not a line item on a budget. and i'm definitely not a pushover. but i am a voter. so washington... before you even think about cutting my medicare and social security benefits... here's a number you should remember. 50 million. we are 50 million seniors who earned our benefits...

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a major blow to one of the country's toughest immigration laws. as of today state officials in alabama cannot check the immigration status of students in the public schools and they cannot file misdemeanor charges against immigrants to fail to carry an alien registration court. police officers are allowed to check a person's immigration status during a lawful stop or arrest. since that law was signed in june, many illegal immigrants have left alabama out of fear of arrest. cnn's david mattingly spoke to one couple who did not want their identities revealed. >> reporter: if could you speak to the people who passed this law, what would you say to them? >> translator: don't be selfish. we all have and want an opportunity. we are not stealing anything from them simply asking them to let us work. >> we're joined by alabama state senator who helped push that law

through the state legislature and cnn legal analyst jeffrey to be toobin. why did the court say no? >> it's a peculiar decision. they veto those two decisions from going into effect and say we'll hear the full case later. i think you can read into what they're saying the laws that sweep so broadly, every student has to prove his or her citizenship and every possible illegal immigrant has to prove and carry papers at all time, that was so broad the court said that was a vital of some provision of the constitution probably due process of law but again they didn't explain it. >> senator, did you go too far? too sweeping? did you go too far here? >> no. i don't believe so. i think that what he said was a misrepresentation. the first provision dealing with schools simply deals with the fact that we're asking for a birth certificate. same thing we ask from every

citizen in the state of alabama to get a handle on the numbers of finding out what the impact really is on our school system. i don't think it went too far. to say it was asking for citizenship is off. the other provision that was stayed was simply a mirror image of what the federal government already asked for. if you're in this country legally, you're supposed to keep documentation with you and we were just mirroring what the federal law already has in place. >> you heard that woman in the introduction saying why don't you just leave us alone and let us work. what's your answer to her? >> it's a lot bigger issue than that. we have a high unemployment rate in our state as so many states do around the country and it's a job issue. when you have an illegal workforce growing by leaps and bounds in your state and we have so many people unemployed, it's a jobs issue. we want to replace that illegal workforce with alabamans and put them into those jobs and keep dollars here to make the state better for years to come. >> the arizona law started this. the alabama law is in the news today. a bunch of other states have

been involved here. utah, arizona, indiana, alabama, georgia, south carolina among them had to pass laws -- i believe arizona was first and other ones coming in. what's the sense that they are all being challenge inned courts. what's the sense of when does the supreme court get involved and decide is this federal purview period or the states can do some things? >> you're right that there are so many laws and they are all being challenged. this is why we have a supreme court. they need to establish what the rules are. this area is so new. the united states supreme court hasn't even issued an opinion that really deals with these issues in many years and these cases are at various steps in the process but i think in the new term the one we're in now that they are going to have to find a way to address at least one of these laws so all of the states have guidance. the law is just a mess and very confusing. >> it is very confusing, senator. how would you answer say for example harry reid that this is proof that states need to get

out of this and leave it to the federal government. we can't have 50 state immigration laws and there needs to be one national standard. how would you answer that? >> i think that's interesting for him to say that because we have a national standard now. there are immigration laws on the books and the federal government has failed to enforce them. so it really doesn't matter what he says about what he wants to pass or what his policy might be. if the federal government is not going to enforce the law and leave it up to states, that's what we're trying to do and a number of states across the country are trying to do. look out for their own citizens and people who elected them. >> senator, what do you do now that the court has put on hold provisions in your law? will you wait and fight this higher up in the courts hoping you win? >> i think it will go through the court system. we feel very good about the law that we passed here. we think we'll be successful in the court system and we're very sure about that. we're going to see what happens. i think it's important that people realize we are trying to do what's best for the people who elected us. there's been a lot of misconception about what this bill does. we're simply trying to play on

the field that we're allowed to play on and look out for the alabamans and good of our state. >> scott beason, appreciate your insight and also our legal analyst jeff toobin. i'll get the title right. i promise you. >> that's all right. >> up next, putting the truth test to something said on the campaign trail. is the claim by anita perry fact or fiction? a guy named his own price, wants a room tonight for 65 dollars. we don't go lower than 130. big deal, persuade him. is it wise to allow a perishable item to spoil? he asked, why leave a room empty? the additional revenue easily covers operating costs.

65 dollars is better than no dollars. okay. $65 for tonight. you can't argue with a big deal.

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jrks. sometimes candidate spouses say the darnest things. >> i suppose i could have stayed home and baked cookies but what i decided to do was fulfill my profession which i entered before my husband was in public life. >> priceless but for a time a distraction. our current first lady had a moment in the 2008 nominating process. >> for the first time in my adult lifetime, i'm really proud of my country and not just because barack has done well but because i think that people are hungry for change. >> she spent a lot of time trying to clean that up but some took it dismissive of flag waving events during her

lifetime. now fast forward to this cycle and its anita perry's turn in the spouse spotlight. last night we talked about this doozy. a suggestion that somehow her husband, rick's, rivals were attacking him because of his christian faith. >> our own party so much of that is that they look at him because of his faith. he's the only true conservati conservative -- there are some conservatives and they are there for good reasons. i truly feel like we are here for that purpose. >> brutalizing rick perry because of his faith? not even close. let's not dwell in the past. mrs. perry is at it again today speaking at a diner in south carolina she told an unemployed

man she shared his pain. mrs. perry said her son was also out of work and added "my son lost his job because of this administration." well, here's tonight's truth. wrong again, mrs. perry. and again not even close. griffin perry did have to give us his job at deutch bank because he's been raising money for his father's campaign and the securities and exchange commission has rules governing political activities. in other words to keep people who may want to get investments in a state pension program like the one in texas from trying to buy political sway through campaign contributions. those rules were tightened effective last year because of shenanigans too many to mention related to the 2008 mortgage mess and broader financial meltdown. griffin perry, the son in question, told abc news recently, he decided to put his career on hold to help his dad.

he said it was his choice. so for mrs. perry to say "my son lost his job because of this administration" doesn't pass the truth test. or to borrow, you might say it's all hat and no cattle. breaking news over the scandal involving the obama's administration's multimillion dollar payment loan to a company. [ male announcer ] what if we told you that cadillac borrowed technology from ferrari to develop its suspension system? or what if we told you that ferrari borrowed technology from cadillac to develop its suspension system? magnetic ride control -- pioneered by cadillac, perfected in the 556-horsepower cts-v.

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more important breakg news involving the white house and congress over a cop called solyndra. that company went bankrupt. $535 million loan from taxpayers that you are now left holding the bill. congress is investigating trying to figure out if the white house ignored warning signs and if any political contributions had any impact on that controversial decision. tonight's breaking news involves a showdown over documents. jessica yellin is here with the latest. >> we just found out that the white house counsel has responded to requests from congress asking the white house to turn over all internal documents related to the loan. what does this mean? obama administration has turned over 70,000 pages of documents. can you imagine going through that? it would not be pretty. about 900 pages from the west wing itself as you know from covering past administrations

this is traditional. it's not a surprise. white house's generally do not turn over these documents because the president wants to protect their conversations with advisers. what's different about this this time is this is the first president who has a blackberry and they want all of the e-mails on the president's blackberry and because the white house is not turning over any of the internal communications it means also nothing from the president's blackberry and none of his e-mails will be turned over to congress. >> this is to fred upton and cliff stearns who heads up the subcommittee. they are essentially saying your most recent request for white house communication from the first day of the current administration to the present implicates long standing and significant institutional executive branch confidentiality and executive privilege no. >> remember from the bush administration there was a time when congress wanted vice president cheney's energy committee was meeting on energy policy and they wouldn't turn over that. this is not an unusual

development. it just intensifies the clash. an ongoing political battle. this is not the last we'll hear of this. >> sometimes cooler heads prevail and they offer up some documents. this seems to suggest they're not going any further. >> they say we'll continue to work to ensure that there will be more documents and more communication so i would not be surprised if we do see more documents coming in the coming weeks just not internal white house documents. more documents could come from the agency. >> we need these documents to see if a donor who backed solyndra convinced you to give this loan when other agencies said not ready for prime time and don't do it. they are clear in here saying such documents don't exist. >> that's right. they say that's just -- you're not going to find it, a, and, b, you can't get everything that happened inside the west wing because the president has to have protected conversations with his advisers like every

other president has had before. >> likely to see more of these as congressional house republicans ramp up oversight and investigations. here's the marker laid down by the white house. thank you for that breaking news. erin is here with a preview. i hear you went to summer camp in china. what did you learn? >> i went to summer camp in china. met with a whole bunch of kids to try to find out whether they were not just working hard and learning but also learning creativity and having fun. we found out amazing things and by the way, i'm holding this up, john. this is the battle hymn of the tiger mother. the bestselling author that many people are watching and familiar with now. this is the book in chinese. bestseller there. big topic of conversation who is raising smarter, better, more well adjusted kids. a special piece on that. you talked to jessica about the solyndra case. it links to this conversation about energy independence and whether it's really achievable. we have done the numbers and got

the bottom line on that and that's also coming up. back to you. have a great weekend. >> you have an hour work left before you get that weekend. we'll see you in a few minutes. when we come back, governor rick perry lays out his jobs plan by drilling more and exploration for energy here in the united states. will it sell? i'll talk to one of the governor's top allies. ya' know those jeans look nice. they do? yup. so you were checking me out? yup. [ male announcer ] progresso. 40 soups 100 calories or less. i'm not a line item on a budget. and i'm definitely not a pushover. but i am a voter. so washington... before you even think about cutting my medicare and social security benefits... here's a number you should remember. 50 million. we are 50 million seniors who earned our benefits... and you will be hearing from us... today and on election day. ♪

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on the trail today, new

energy exploration was talked about by rick perry. >> we're standing on top of the next american economic boom and it's the energy underneath this country and the quickest way to give our economy a shot in the arm is to deploy the american ingenuity to tap american energy. >> governor perry says his plan would create 1.2 million jobs, expand energy exploration in alaska and permit more offshore drilling and approve use of new pipelines. it's part of an effort to stop a major slide in the polls and stop conservative charity he's failing to prove himself a viable national candidate. earlier i discussed the plan and the stakes with a top perry supporter, governor jindal. one of the questions we're hearing today not only from the obama white house but from some of governor perry's republican rivals is where are the rest? they say he lays out this energy plan. he talks about 1.2 million jobs.

there are 25 million americans who are either unemployed or underemployed and they say governor perry is late to the game with a broader jobs program. how would you answer that? >> a couple things. first of all, i would look at not only what rick is saying but what rick has done in texas. in the last two years they created over 40% of the jobs created in america. under president obama the country has lost 2 million jobs and texas they've created over a million jobs. he's not just talking about a plan, he's showing how to actually implement a plan. he showed in texas if you cut taxes and enact tort reform and cut government spending and provide a predictable business environment, you can grow private sector jobs. he'll outline a specific set of plans to do that for the country. the energy plan is a great first step. over a million jobs. >> if this is a good down payment in your view from governor perry, how urgent is the challenge for him. you have seen him slipping in the polls. herman cain is getting a lot of attention with his 9-9-9 tax

plan. how urgent is the political pressure on governor perry to fill in the rest of the picture? >> this is a long campaign. i think that this is not going to be decided by a couple debates or polls or pundits. this is going to take several months. that's the way it should be. too often there's a rush to preselect the nominee. this is an open debate. that's good for the candidates. it will be good for the voters. secondly, i think he's got plenty of time to outline his specific proposals. one of the reasons i'm supporting rick and one of the things that makes him a strong candidate is every candidate is going to put out specifics proposals. rick is not just talking the talk but walked the walk. he can point to what he's done in texas. he's been governor for over ten years. their economy has grown. they surpassed new york to be the second largest economy. they add jobs while the country is losing jobs. growing the private sector. under president obama we're losing private sector jobs. >> the obama campaign was quick to say this about governor perry's plan saying the energy policy isn't the way to win the future. straight out of the past.

doubling down on finite resources with no plan to promote innovation or transition the nation to a clean energy economy and to back up that statement they would say that to them governor perry sounds a lot like this from the last campaign. >> you betcha we'll drill, baby drill and mine, baby mine because we need american energy resources brought to you by american ingenuity and produced by american workers. >> wasn't enough to sway things last time. what makes you think that focus on energy will make a big difference this time? >> a couple of things. when you look at texas not only largest producer oil and gas but wind energy as well. governor perry is advocating an all of the above approach. you have two alternative visions. you have the president who he and his senior advisers said they want to drive up the cost of energy and make it more

expensive to produce energy in this country and governor perry understands affordable, reliable energy is good for american utility payers and drivers and manufacturers. >> you know your friend's debate performances have been shaky. people close to the governor say we have a tired puppy on our hands. we need to get him more rest heading into future debates. what do you tell him where he came out and rocketed to the top of the field and now a slump period. what do you tell him to keep his spirits up? >> well, i told him a couple things. campaigns are going to be ups and downs. you can't believe your best press or worst press. stick to your convictions and principles and offer a clear cons eervative voters. they're not looking for the best most polished speaker. they are looking for someone with proven results and a proven conservative record who will stick to his principles. governor perry has done that. he will do that. this is going to be a long, long

campaign. this is a marathon. it's not a sprint. a lot of campaigning left to go. he's going to do well. the more he talks about what he's done in texas and what he wants to do for our country, today is a good first step. no one policy proposal will win this election. today is a good step in the right direction for the perry campaign. >> louisiana govern area bobby jindal, thank you for your time tonight. >> thanks, john. great talking to you. >> we had a conversation the other night after the debate. you were tough on governor perry. this is his first entry if you will into the policy debate. biggest policy debate in country over the economy. was it big enough and bold enough? >> i think it's a really good start. i agree with a lot of what govern area jindal has said that this is a marathon and not a sprint and we have a lot of people in the republican establishment that are very, very eager to go ahead and crown a nominee but the race is just gun. it's a really good start for rick perry. i'm glad to see someone put so much focus on energy.

i hope to see more mentions of the keystone project and jobs created with that. this was a good start. >> you could argue that you are an energy state governor. start in your wheel house if you are trying to prove that you get it, start in your wheel house. you could say that we know that about you. what about the tax code when herman cain is doing this stuff? >> governor perry proved he knows nothing about the energy industry. the idea that there are any set of regulatory changes that will produce a 50% increase in oil and gas employment is not talking the talk. it's talking gibberish. it was an ignorant speech. >> what do you really think though? >> when you look at the economic modelling and when you sort of take apart the plan and say what economic model brought you this? you are working with people who do not know what they're talking about. i don't think it's complementary

to republican voters that they will buy this. >> you are a serious policy republican and serious policy conservative and you say it's not a serious policy. >> it's not a serious policy. there are ways that it is possible that you could increase employment in the oil and gas sector but you won't get a 50% increase from regulatory changes given also that total output in the oil and gas sector in the united states is probably at best going to remain about stable and may rise only slightly. >> here's my problem with what governor perry did. it wasn't enough. he keeps complaining that mitt romney has had years to come up with policies and plans and ideas and he's been in this six or eight weeks. the reason you get in a presidential race is because you have ideas that you want to sell to the american public. you don't get in the race first and then decide you need to get some ideas that you can sell to the public. i think he's got it a bit backwards. >> stay put.

when we come back, two wealthiest candidates for president, maybe they want to be associated with occupy wall street. they claim they are unemployed. we'll explain next. a guy named his own price, wants a room tonight for 65 dollars. we don't go lower than 130. big deal, persuade him. is it wise to allow a perishable item to spoil? he asked, why leave a room empty? the additional revenue easily covers operating costs. 65 dollars is better than no dollars. okay. $65 for tonight. you can't argue with a big deal. i just signed the whole family up for unlimited mobile to mobile minutes. you're kidding. no. where's that money coming from, steve?

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will be giving away passafree copies of the alcoholism & addiction cure. to get yours, go to ssagesmalibubook.com. texas governor rick perry was all over the morning news shows sitting down with networks to promote the big energy and economy speech we just talked about. that's what he wanted to talk about but he couldn't avoid questions about this. >> by our opponents and our own

party so much of that is that they look at him because of his faith. >> family members always take these campaigns substantially more personally than the candidate. i do have one of the one of the finest women in the world that i could be married to and she's passionate. my wife said two things. he's the most conservative man in the race and he's a christian and i can't argue with either one of those facts. >> and gloria borger is here. it's interesting when the spouse becomes a distraction or issue in the campaign. >> bad. >> i understand her frustration. i don't mean -- it is hard on family members when they watch their husband, wife, or whatever having struggles. but to say that he's being beat up by his opponents over his faith, nobody has beat up rick perry because he's a christian. >> no. and, in fact, rick perry's the one that has gotten into the

controversy over religion with mitt romney. i think, look, this is a presidential campaign. you're going to get brutalized by your opponents. that's going to happen. it's never a good idea to turn the candidate into a victim. because that makes him look weak and she's complaining about it and this is the race they got into for whatever reason. and then he had to defend her. personally, i believe the husband should always defend their wives, but it doesn't put him in a good spot. >> it's always hard to go to the spouse and say, please, say that again? ? >> god bless her and if mitt romney had been introducing by an attack but since it was the guy who introduced rick perry who attacked mitt romney's religion, i don't think she has a point. >> how does play out in the

blogosphere. they haven't criticized him for his faith and today she said that president obama cost her son his job. that's not true. how is the reaction to mrs. perry been at the grass roots level? >> i don't think it's had much of an impact. i don't think i've seen much criticism of rick perry's faith. the it's the same people that went over mormons over the prop 8 issue are now in the position of defending mormons with mitt romney. so it's been a very interesting situation and i would have to disagree with mr. frohm. i don't think the rick perry speech is ignorant. i think, too, when you want to talk about their plans and whose record is what, rick perry's record as governor far outweighs the records of a lot of candidates, especially mitt romney. i had to clarify that. i had to put that out there. >> a spicy debate is a good thing. we've all watched with some fascination and some sort of

where is this going question mark, the occupy wall street protest. but interestingly, on the campaign trail, we're going to have a little bit of fun here. listen to two candidates here. here's number one. he's at the top of the national post, herman cain, about his job status. >> i don't do radio anymore, folks, because when you run for president, you have to be unemployed. i think that's a silly rule. but i'm unemployed. but that's okay. i'm not in it for the money right now. you know, the teleprompter fell off the bus on the way over here. >> that's herman cain in tennessee here. the guy has a sense of humor about him. this is former governor of massachusetts mitt romney back in june. >> maybe i should tell my story. i'm also unemployed.

and i'm networking. >> a lot better than what we've known. >> but i have my sight on a particular job i'm looking for. i know exactly what i'm aiming for. it's a lot of work. >> okay. dana, are we supposed to shed any tears. mitt romney is estimated between 190, $200 million and herman cain in the estimate of $18 million. so maybe they are unemployed but i'm not supposed to cry, am i? >> no. i think they were being facecious with it. i think herman cain had a point with it. if they continued working, their jobs would come under fire, or their business. so i think it was just a joke.

i laughed at cain's remark. >> we like humor in politics, right? >> we like humor. i think those jokes would be funnier if the unemployment rate were 5% than they are at the current rate. >> so you have to be careful. if you're trying to make fun of it why you are here. here's a giruy, all of the republican candidates are out here. would you take advice from this guy? >> well, you know, it sounds rather simplistic, wolf, but my one advice to him would be two things. get some rest and when you're tired, every time i made a serious mistake, i made a serious mistake politically and i've made them. it's been when i'm tired. and the second thing is, get somebody in there who will really give it a good scrubbing, who will play these individuals, who will play romney, for example. and really put it to you so that you're prepared for any question

that comes up. i think both of those would probably help him. >> that was debate advice to rick perry, get some sleep and have somebody spar with you. do you think they are skrcribblg down what -- >> well, he should. it's good advice. i remember bill clinton saying that the worst mistakes he made was when he was tired. i remember mitt romney when he said that, he was tired. this is good advice and it's his way of saying, you have to prepare for these debates. it's not texas. >> and no one is in a better position to advise rick perry than john mccain in a similar situation. at the top he collapsed and then through sheer grit and guts, he came back to win the nomination and what he was doing in the weeks before he won new hampshire nomination, had he no money and yet he was the hardest

working. it's an inspiring story. and he's a guy that if i were in rick perry's shoes, he would be a guy that i would want to -- >> yeah, because he beat mitt romney. i would do the exact opposite of john mccain said. his advise was the hardest thing that i've heard, though. i'm not a huge mccain fan. he seems like a lovely man, though. >> don't forget, he did beat mitt romney. >> i like to chalk that being the lesser of two evils at the time. >> to the broader point, we have al debate coming up on tuesday in nevada. governor perry has been struggling. on the one hand, people say it's silly. when a guy gets in like thark rockets to the top, and then goes down, how important is it being panned in three consecutive debates now? did governor perry have a home

run performance? >> he needs to have a red bull before this debate. many two red bulls and a cup of coffee on the top of it. he kind of came alive, the last debate, and then it fizzled out. this is really important because a lot of people, when michele bachmann first got into this race, nobody outside of the tea party knows who michele bachmann is. nobody followed her. and rick perry is sort of the same way. he's governor of texas and everybody knows him in texas but a lot of people outside of texas aren't familiar with perry's records on jobs. they are not familiar with the missteps that he's taken on immigration. these debates, it's when america can vet these candidates and it's when they can sell themselves to the american public. they are hugely important. >> niece are ga lat particularly important. >> the most important ever. >> i saw him interviewed by george, that's a morning program, and he could not

intelligently talk about hjobs plan. there's an intelligent nimbleness. when he doesn't have a written answer, he doesn't know what to do. >> i think he needs to have ideas. he needs to have things to say so he can establish a breath of experience that people would say, he's presidential. >> there are a lot of smart economists out there with alternatives. if you can't master that as the governor as the second biggest state in the country for ten years -- >> this is a job interview. debates are job interviews, and he's got to brag about himself. >> david is saying that he's not intellectually capable. >> see, i disagree. i heard perry speak without a teleprompter. i think it's perhaps the pressure of the national stage. he's horrible at debates.